Following a report today that Apple was hiring experts from the automotive industry for a new research lab, The Wall Street Journal adds to the story claiming Apple has several hundred employees working on an Apple-branded electric car:
Apple has several hundred employees working secretly toward creating an Apple-branded electric vehicle, according to people familiar with the matter. They said the project, code-named “Titan,” has an initial design of a vehicle that resembles a minivan, one of these people said.
The report adds that CEO Tim Cook approved the project close to a year ago with product design Vice President Steve Zadesky, a former Ford executive, leading the group. The news lines up with rumors that Apple is working on something that will “give Tesla a run for its money.”
Mirroring other recent reports that Apple was poaching experts from the automotive industry, WSJ notes that Zadesky “was given permission to create a 1,000-person team and poach employees from different parts of the company.” Earlier today the Financial Times reported that Apple has hired president and CEO of Mercedes-Benz Research & Development Johann Jungwirth, along with other auto industry execs, to work at a new, secretive automotive research lab. Apple has also been locked in a poaching war with Tesla, attempting to lure away that company’s employees with big bonuses.
Adding to that, the report from the WSJ says the location of the lab is just a few miles from Apple’s HQ in Cupertino and currently includes employees working on “robotics, metals and materials consistent with automobile manufacturing.”
In addition to the new hires and research lab, the report claims Apple has met with contract manufacturers that produce high-end vehicles. Several minivans leased to Apple with camera arrays and other equipment have also been spotted in some major cities over the past few months.
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IMO, buying Tesla would make a lot more sense, including from a branding perspective.
I agree.
It definitely would be a smart move, assuming Musk was willing to sell. His personality/ego is so wrapped up in it I doubt he ever would sell, no matter the offer.
Tesla is a publicly traded company in which Elon Musk owns no where near 51% of the company and would have little say in its sale, if a behemoth like Apple wanted to buy.
Nah. Tesla has no actual tech to purchase. Their battery tech is nothing new it’s the same basic lithium batteries that have been in every portable electric device for years and years.
IMO the only reason for Apple to get into this is if the have a new battery tech up their sleeves. Something *different* from Tesla and al the rest.
Not only that, when it comes to manufacturing and supply chain management, Apple has Tesla beat hands down. This news is big, if true. Very exciting.
So, their electronic engines are not technical innovations? They’re just basic electronic engines that everybody can build? What about the large number of smart engineers at Tesla including their CEO?
What makes you think it has to do with batteries only? Why not buy Tesla for their CEO and the staff full of smart engineers that Apple is losing lately?
@mikhailt: Electric cars have been feasible and available to buy for nearly 40 years. Tesla’s main “innovation” is to use a different kind of battery (basically a big laptop battery), instead of what has been used previously. Everything else they have done, has been done previously by other manufacturers before them. That’s pretty much it for “innovation” from Tesla. You’ve just fallen for their marketing is all.
Furthermore, it could be argued that the whole point of Teslas cars is that they are NOT “innovative.” Most electric cars that have been manufactured and sold previously, used innovative styling or construction methods, or materials that are not typically used in cars and were thus only saleable to geeky eco-warriors.
The whole point of a Tesla is that it’s a luxury “sports” or performance car (or sedan), that is more or less indistinguishable from a “regular” luxury car. In other words, other than the fact that it’s electric, it’s supposed to be pretty much 100% swappable with your average Lexus or Mercedes or whatever. That’s their whole raison d’être.
Electronic cars have been feasible and available for over a hundred years not just 50.
Being a Lux car maker is not Tesla’s raison d’être, as they scale up their production runs they will move into the mid-priced market. The luxury cars are paying for their R&D. And to characterise their cars as nothing new is oversimplifying the innovation that goes into such a ground breaking move into the auto market. Like saying computers had been around for ages Apple ][ or Mac or iMac was nothing new. Or even the iPod, iRiver was around, small HDDs were around they just got first dibs on an even smaller one from Sony because they were looking in the right places to make their vision a reality.
Musk has said that if the company could keep at current growth rates, it would be worth as much as Apple is today ($US700 billion) within 10 years. If that’s “nothing new” then WTF didn’t you or anyone else do it?
Why buy it when Tesla has already tossed its patents and is giving its intellectual property away for free?
True. I guess they’re assuming $25B would be worth the head start it would give them. But I think in this case perhaps doing it themselves (with those open-source patents) from scratch could lead to some innovating accidental discoveries. Perhaps Apple’s innovative operation combined with external industry expertise may prove an interesting combination. I just h
If Apple wants any leverage in the selling price of Tesla, they have to at least *pretend* to have an in-house competitor. Otherwise they need Tesla more than Tesla needs Apple, and that is not a strong bargaining position.
Buying Tesla makes zero sense. It is overpriced. And it makes NO MONEY. In fact, Tesla won’t make a profit until 2020.
Buying BMW for $64 BILLION makes far more sense. BMW already has electric cars in production which challenge the Tesla both in price and performance and in branding. BMW makes $11 BILLION a year in profit. And BMW sells 1.8 MILLION LUXURY cars a year. Apple can simply transition BMW to an all-electric car company. The luxury is already there. The profit is already there. Instead of giving back $64 billion to stockholders as a dividend, Apple can simply BUY BMW. ALL OF IT.
Absolutely not.
Tesla needs competition, they encourage others to enter the electric car game; because they see the traditional cars as the competition. That’s why they opened their patents. If the e-car revolution comes about sooner rather than later, Tesla wins. This is a unique competitive positions – more entrants make it better for everyone.
Apple, if building a car, likewise needs Tesla to pioneer markets, sales methods, power stations, and so on. Tesla opened all its patents so their tech is basically free for all to copy.
Building a team and expertise that can take on Tesla will be expensive for Apple – but it won’t cost anywhere near Tesla’s $23Bn market cap. And then there’s all the integration issues, the best people leaving etc etc. Much better to go their own way.
Why would Apple want to design a car? Hmmmmm……
A rather extreme way to diversify the business? :-p
Obviously to improve people’s lives.
And to make more profit.
The average car has 27 computers. Modern cars are simply computers on wheels. So it is natural for Apple to create a mobile computer called a car.
It would’ve been better to buy or partner with Tesla instead. There’s a reason many former Apple employees are working at Tesla instead, their CEO knows exactly what he’s doing.
I don’t see how Apple can outdo Tesla here, they’re not working against competitors who doesn’t seem to know what they’re doing in terms of experience. Tesla knows exactly about the car experience, look at their stores, customer-focused methods to drive their sales.
But, I have been surprised by Apple in the past, so we’ll see. I just wish they’d focus on their QA instead.
Apple will make it mass producible and no doubt produce a range of overpriced accessories, such as colour panels, charging cables etc. And of course, it will only charge at an Apple charging station.
Bruno, some might agree with you… but I believe Tesla open sourced their battery technology so essentially there is no reason to buy Tesla if they have that knowledge.
Well considering there is nothing particularly special about Tesla’s battery tech, that makes sense.
You obviously have a deep understanding of electric cars LOL
@Fourthletter58:
I do. I’ve been following the industry rather closely since about 1974.
Just because this is the first time you are hearing that Tesla is not the innovative company it’s been made out to be, doesn’t make it untrue. What you read in the press, and what the actual facts are, are rarely the same thing.
Tesla have a lot more patents than just batteries. They have tonnes of patents around dual battery energy management software (think metal air range extender plus LithIon for everyday or maybe even a Graphene super-capacitor).
That would frighten me off as an investor. It’s like they are admitting that they don’t even know what kind of battery tech will eventually win out, and that it doesn’t matter to them either. Such a lack of vision!
Total lack yet, Musk is a brilliant man and you…sitting here commenting. Where is your car company? Oh wait…
So, let me get this straight, you are reporting that Apple is building a minivan.
My thoughts exactly. Only way they are building minivans of its for their own employees to drive to the spaceship. Apple selling a minivan to the public makes zero sense.
Well, if they wanted to “change the world” as they are always saying they do, making another minivan is not the way to go about it. If Apple makes a car, it would likely be an electric one or two seater. Like a smart car but electric, and Apple branded.
If they instead make something like Tesla, this is how you will know that they have gone off the rails, because “luxury sedans for rich Californians” ain’t gonna change anything, ever.
That’s the first smart thing you said on this thread, Gazoo Bee!
I bet they first make a minivan for employee shuttles on their campus, use the lessons from that to build a production car for the masses. One step at a time.
I love minivans – it’s the best car. So yes – bring on the Apple minivan!!
Damn. Now I have to get a driver’s licence.
You don’t need a license to drive something that doesn’t exist.
MMM.. this photo is a Honda 7″ Infotainment unit from a 2015 Civic
Maybe to travel around the campuses and not for actual mass production?
Doubt they would poach1,000 employees for an internal transportation project.
There have been clues toward Apple making a car for years. Jony Ive and Marc Newson have been dissing American cars lately in interviews, Phil Schiller said Apple discussed making a car and a camera after the initial success of the iPod, and Steve Jobs said he wanted to take on Detroit. Also, Apple execs always say Apple builds products that they themselves would want, and Jony and other execs love both watches and cars. It’s the Apple Car launching in 2019, then Jony Ive retires on 2022.
Link?
@horace deidu talked about the idea of mobile devices being the “brains” of a car … I like the idea of having a native devices (a car) to plug my second brain (my iPhone) into, then sync my podcasts, calls, maps, contact info, maps etc with. Smart move apple, please also disrupt cable and “TV” though too please.
Seems like Apple would be better suited to go after Tesla’s home backup battery for powering the home during a power outage. This leaves room for Apple to go over oars with Homekkt.
My guess is this is still for employees and. It the general,public.
Apple doesn’t make batteries though, they buy the from Sony.
Oh no…. Tesla needs to step it up. I wonder if apple will have same problems as Tesla, in most states you can’t even buy a Tesla.
It won’t matter since no one will be able to buy an Apple Car. It will be too expensive.
I believe if they’re making a car it will be similar to the Watch in that there will be a relatively affordable cheaper model, a more expensive, moderately better model, and an extremely expensive luxury model akin to a Ferrari.
“relatively affordable cheaper model” HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
That seems spectacular, I would love to see that. If it’s directed to the masses, of course.
Would a car go against the same reason Apple hasn’t made a television yet? Long upgrade cycle and lower profits.
I think if Apple makes a television set it won’t be until they can be folded up into small boxes, so storage and distribution are much easier, and cheaper. I don’t think Apple should make a television set though, due to long upgrade cycles. I believe a far far superior Apple TV, rebranded TV which the hundreds of millions of people with HDTVs could simply plug into the wall and into their TV would be far better.
Taken out of hobby status and given a truly 21st century UI which makes since for TV with apps, an App Store, new and extremely simple, yet sophisticated input methods (along with the obvious Siri integration), and an innovative and groundbreaking content delivery solution to take an extremely archaic, clunky, horrific UI/GUI TV experience, into the future. Handoff your content from device to device seamlessly, picking up where you left off. It would also be a central hub for homekit which your iPhone would talk to while you were away from home, and the TV would control all of your connected homekit devices. A little more crazy thought to add on: it would also be a wireless router which could beam content, to multiple, smaller TV Pods around your home which are connected to other TVs. These could be controlled via a remote/Siri/iPhone/iPad/Watch, and allow you to view content around the house, on other TVs. Okay I’m done lol
Agree, except for the packaging. They stored Cinema Displays, 27 inch iMacs, and G5-style Mac Pro towers just fine.
Reasons why a physical TV set might be good though: beautiful slim design, 4K resolution, intuitive UI w PrimeSense sensors, FaceTime cameras.
TV sets are a thing of the past. TV sets are also good enough to watch the crappy cable channels for those who still do that. It’s an uninteresting market.
Once E-Cars and autonomous vehicles come along, every single person will buy a new car. That alone is huge. This market is huge, huge, huge.
The reason Apple is building a car is: Tesla. Following Tesla’s business plan to a T. Tesla is betting e-cars and autonomous cars will totally upend the car market, allowing a new entrant to create vastly better products which will then completely destroy the dinosaurs. Clearly some of the old car companies will adjust. The bet is, many of them won’t.
Tim Cook is being a CEO. Instead of focusing on innovation and making the current suffering products better as his predecessor did, he’s allocating valuable resources toward making a car.
You don’t have much evidence to support this haha. by the way ios 9 according to reports is focused on fixing bugs.
Actually he does, the Internet is plagued by iOS 7 & 8 / iPhone problems, though a lot might not seem like a huge issue to some, you are still paying for a faulty product which does not work as it should. I myself am a long time iPhone fan, but horrified as to the problems that have surfaced in the past wether mine, relatives or strangers, if I was Tim Cook, I’d be ashamed to roll out iOS 7 and still have bugs after iOS 8.1.3. 9 to 5 mac have already reported as to iOS 8 suffering due to the watch release. So how would the watch and iPhone suffer for the release of this car?
Apple is worth more than the entire space shuttle budget from 1980 through its close. They could afford to do more than a few things of this scale at the same time without neglecting their legacy businesses.
They could buy Google if it made sense for them to do so. Or Microsoft.
I think Steve Jobs would be thrilled.
YOU NEED TO STUDY ECONOMICS, JUST HIGH SCHOOL LEVEL WOULD BE ENOUGH.
Oh come on. Thinking to the future is EXACTLY what a CEO should be doing. Snow Leopard-ing iOS and OS X will carry Apple through what, September 2015? Then what, when Apple Watch adds 10-20% to Apple’s revenue? What’s going to be the next hit in 5 years when the 2020 trolls, analysts and investors are clamoring for innovation and new products? Super-stable OS releases?
I can see it now… “Waiting for brake to respond”
“I’m really sorry. I won’t be able to drive you today. Please try again later.”
The late night sketches write themselves.
I can’t wait to see the Software Developer Kit for this one.. It’s bold of Apple to dive into the auto industry but with the company now worth almost twice as much as Exon Mobile Oil, and top forward thinking engineers on the job, I’m sure something fresh is looming on the horizon.. Still I have to wonder, will I be able to start it with my Apple Watch?
If you couldn’t start it with your Watch, there is no hope for humans. You’d be able to start it, lock it, turn on/off lights, check charge level, bring out the handles which fall back into the body, and pop the hood/trunk by raising your wrist next to them.
Gee I hope they don’t make a car that would really ruin my Apple collection as I have at least 1 of apples different products and there is no way on earth I could ever afford an Apple Car hence it will break my chain go Apple gadgets so please this is not good news for mad collectors like myself lol
On Apple gadgets not go Apple gadgets. sorry for the typo :-)
I’m sorry, I don’t buy into this idea just like I didn’t buy into the idea of Apple building TV’s. If anything, I’d say Apple has an automotive team examining the automobile and experimenting with how the iPhone/iOS can better integrate with the automotive hardware. As cars become more advanced and connected, Apple wants to provide a better and seamless UI experience layer.
Yea but why would they need to know what kind of materials the thing is made of? I was skeptical too but the talent/knowledge base assembled seems to go way beyond advanced CarPlay. A hundreds or thousand-strong Skunkworks sounds exactly like early iPad/iPhone teams assembling in 2004/2005. I’d put the timeline at 5 years. That’s around the same time Tesla is planning it’s $30,000 car.
DING! DING! DING! Winner, Winner, Chicken Dinner! I’ve been waiting to read a sentiment that echoes mine exactly.
Samsung HQ: “It is a car next. Quick, they started 1 year ago, we need to be first to market. Hurry up!”
cue the Galaxy Sedan and Galaxy Crossover
Considering Samsung was already in the car business for, oh, the last 15_ years…. your comment is pretty idiotic.
I know, duh. You know what I meant: trying to guess what Apple was going to do and copy it even before it comes out.
Samsung also made phones before iPhone, you know ;)
Coming soon: the Samsung Galaxy People Mover.
S-Car
Quite. Put an ‘S’ sign on the side, have it race at high velocity and people will shout out:
“Look at that “S-car-go!”
Brilliant! Do you mind if we borrow this? -Samsung Marketing Dept.
This sounds very interesting. I love the thought.
Is Apple biting off more than they can chew? Pun intended.
I agree, purchasing Tesla would’ve been a solid move, however, I don’t think Musk would’ve budged. Clearly Apple and Tesla met months ago, and clearly nothing came out of it.
http://www.cnet.com/news/apples-m-a-chief-reportedly-met-with-tesla-ceo-elon-musk/
While I applaud Apple forging into new territory, the idea of building an electric car has me thinking Apple might find themselves falling short in their ambitions. Hopefully not. Remember Apple wanting to over jump Google and its services? Now look at Google Now vs Siri, or Google Maps vs Apple Maps. The thinking and ambition is there, but the focus and execution sometimes fall shorts. Lots of wants, but it sometimes seems that they are stretching themselves out and they’re losing their laser sharp focus they have always been known for. Hopefully, if they make this rumoured car happen, it’ll give Tesla a run for its money, because let’s face it, the next 10-15 years is when we’ll fully understand if a, Tim Cook led Apple, was indeed, the right course of action for Silicon’s Valley’s beloved fruit.
You can talk about Siri bs Google now which both don’t work frequently so good luck explaining which is better, but saying Google maps vs Apple maps makes no sense. Yes, Apple shouldn’t have released it when they did, and yes it may be far worse at some things, but I can conclusively say Google maps is garbage in plenty of areas still, like for example locations of businesses. Maps is something that takes time to get right, and a lot of people in my opinion. Apple is likely doing far more exciting things with maps anyway. Street view is nice, but it’s pitiful compared to what a 3D virtual reality ground level maps could be. I believe Apple is working on this exact thing.
Hey! I am a manufacturing engineer from GMC, I want to work on this project. Call me.
James Peterson
517-896-4275
iCa…the tesla for the rest of us…..
Really? Have you taken note of Apple’s pricing vs. the rest of the market?