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Department of Justice: iPhone encryption will lead to the death of a child

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Apple and the government have long been engaged in a bitter war of words over encryption and security practices employed in Apple’s iOS devices, but a new Wall Street Journal report indicates that the Department of Justice is really starting to take the rhetoric to the next level.

According to the Journal, a DOJ official actually told Apple executives during a meeting last month that in the future the Cupertino company could eventually be directly responsible for the death of a child.

The logic behind this point? There will come a day when criminals—perhaps a kidnapper—will rely on Apple’s encrypted devices to hide themselves from the ever-watchful eye of the government. The inability of law enforcement to access the data on that person’s phone, the official argued, would inevitably allow them to evade detection and kill a child.

Apple execs reportedly decried the latest example in the government’s apparent war on privacy as “inflamatory” and said that the Department of Justice could acquire the information it needed to save the child from other sources, such as cellular carriers, in such a situation.

The company came under fire from the public after it was revealed last year that government agencies like the National Security Administration had reportedly gained backdoor access to iOS devices and were using it to spy on civilians.

Apple responded by introducing improved data encryption in its latest software update and creating a new website that detailed its commitment to customer privacy. The company has long held that its iMessage text messaging platform supports end-to-end encryption that made it impervious to prying eyes, much to the disappointment of government officials.

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Comments

  1. How to manipulate yourself into the high moral ground via brute force, lesson #1: liken your opponent to either a murderer or someone who causes harm to children. For best results, both.

  2. InformNow (@InformedNow) - 9 years ago

    Is this the same DoJ that took the death penalty off of a case involving 4 gang member who kidnapped and executed an off duty cop?!? Death is always going to be out there because scum is always out there! And if anyone would know scum, it’s Holder! http://www.cbsnews.com/news/suspects-in-viginia-police-officer-killing-will-not-face-death-penalty/

    • Gregory Wright - 9 years ago

      Well, your comment is just as extreme and stupid as the Justice Department.

      • No it’s not. He’s telling the truth. The truth is not extreme.

      • Yeah, nice try to make it sound like these guys got a written warning and were let go. Since you’re all such legal experts in these matters, please tell us how you would adjudicate what you consider a slam-dunk case.

        “Holder! Fast and Furious! Holder!” one note cranks.

  3. HallCorridor - 9 years ago

    “the Cupertino company could eventually be directly responsible for the death of a child.”
    Unless Apple is going around murdering people, they’d, at best, be indirectly responsible for the death of a child…

    • herb02135go - 9 years ago

      I’d take this with a grain of salt.
      What’s the quote? Or was it paraphrased?

      When the DOJ comes down hard on gun users that kill children then I will listen.

      • iphonenick (@iphonenick) - 9 years ago

        Herb’s first rational post on 9to5mac.com. Wow.

      • herb02135go - 9 years ago

        Screw you, Nick. Don’t mess with my rep!

      • HallCorridor - 9 years ago

        My quote is from paragraph 2 in this article

      • 89p13 - 9 years ago

        OK – Who hijacked Herb’s account and made a sane, logical and rational post?

        Who Did This? :)

  4. lexxkoto - 9 years ago

    “Guns don’t kill people. Dangerous people do.”
    “Cars don’t kill people. Bad drivers do.”
    “A child gets kidnapped? Totally Apple’s fault, not the kidnappers.”

  5. Jimmy Song - 9 years ago

    Ridiculous. The very same argument could be made by the government to legalize torture to get to the information stored in a criminal’s head: “it could lead to the death of a child if you don’t let us do it.”

  6. depicus - 9 years ago

    And people wonder why ‘Merica is the laughing stock of the rest of the world.

    • No, in America people are free to think and say what they want, it’s that just the stupid ones get all the attention.

      • Mike Knopp (@mknopp) - 9 years ago

        Close, but America’s real problem is that the corrupt or stupid or both keep getting elected to office.

      • patthecarnut - 9 years ago

        Mike that is 100% true!

  7. nekomichikun - 9 years ago

    Winter gloves could result in the death of a child! Gloves can be used by a criminal to prevent leaving fingerprints at a crime scene and therefore help them evade detection and arrest. We must ban all types of gloves from sale at once because it’s clearly the glove’s fault for the death of innocent children, not the wearer’s.

  8. Brady Coye - 9 years ago

    Good thing the DOJ only spies on guilty child kidnappers! Oh wait…

  9. Michael Weisberg - 9 years ago

    Please won’t someone think of the children!?!?! Oh god….who will think of the poor children?

  10. Adam Rice (@adamrice) - 9 years ago

    Does the DoJ know the identity of the unlucky child yet?

  11. sardonick - 9 years ago

    One side just more ridiculous than the other. Seems the gov and companies alike are taking turns being the dope of the day. Nice job DOJ for taking the lead on the moron award this time.

  12. philboogie - 9 years ago

    DOJ: “We’re childish!”

  13. herb02135go - 9 years ago

    I’d take this with a grain of salt.
    What’s the quote? Or was it paraphrased?

    When the DOJ comes down hard on gun users that kill children then I will listen.

  14. Jason Ames - 9 years ago

    So, are they threatening to kill a child if apple doesn’t change its policy?

  15. bdkennedy1 - 9 years ago

    Children will die without encryption.

  16. darevsek - 9 years ago

    AHHHH… the “think of the children” ploy. It’a ALWAYS for the children… but the children… you know, the children… gun safety for the… oh wait, they ignore that one… kids… kids… kids… kids…

    Encryption will kill bunny’s… think of the bunny.s… please won’t you think of the bunny’s… encryption kills bunny’s…

    I am so sick of the “children” ploy… grow some damn balls and actually say the truth. You don’t like it because you can’t spy on or use the info to your advantage, because you know a judge will not sign a warrant for you. “Children” ploy is as bad as the “terrorist” ploy. My mind is use either of those ploy’s and you have done lost the argument. And your grasping for straws.

  17. Harvey Lubin - 9 years ago

    “Department of Justice: iPhone encryption will lead to the death of a child”… and puppies will look at you with sad eyes.

    (͡° ͜ʖ°)

  18. triguyfun - 9 years ago

    Sounds like Apple understands our Constitution better than the DOJ.

    VERY SAD!! If DOJ could just DO their job instead of have companies like Apple do it for them, we’d all be better off!! Cudos to Apple for doing what’s right!!!

  19. bobborries - 9 years ago

    Liberal politicians always play “The Children” card, when they don’t get they’re way.

    • iphonenick (@iphonenick) - 9 years ago

      “Liberal politicians”? The DOJ is a government agency, not a political party.

    • katherinwaters - 9 years ago

      Yeah, “liberals” like George W. Bush, John McCain, Karl Rove, Dick Cheney, John Boehner, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.

    • triguyfun - 9 years ago

      You may want to look up the work Liberal. If you do, you may find out just how ridiculous your statement is.

    • Mike Knopp (@mknopp) - 9 years ago

      Oh! You still buy into the smoke and mirrors that is liberal vs conservative? The political machine loves you. They can always depend on your vote for one of their three or four hand picked candidates.

    • Darwin Evolved - 9 years ago

      Fear-mongering is the calling card of the NeoCon right- from they are coming for your guns to fear of teaching children evolution to fear of ‘The Gay’. Most Conservative people are motivated more by fear than anything else.

      The American Revolution was not started, endorsed by, supported by or of conservative people. The Conservatives were Royalists and many fled to Canada or other British colonies. They have been screwing up America ever since.

  20. robertsm76 - 9 years ago

    If anyone of our wives, kids, moms etc goes missing we’d be pissed if we couldn’t track them down because of how tight apples encryption is.

    • iphonenick (@iphonenick) - 9 years ago

      So by your logic, let’s ban all vehicles that can’t be tracked by the DOJ or the FBI.

      • robertsm76 - 9 years ago

        Nope. But if your daughter had an iPhone and went missing would you not be upset with apple?

      • Mike Knopp (@mknopp) - 9 years ago

        Possibly, but laws should not be made based on emotion, but logic and reason.

        It is the same reason that they don’t let doctors practice on their relatives and judges should recuse themselves from cases where they know a party. They are too close to the problem.

        Look at it another way. If my daughter went missing I would want to kill anybody and everybody that got in my way, but that doesn’t mean murder should be legal. Does it?

    • herb02135go - 9 years ago

      You wife or child is more likely to be killed by gun violence.

      Are you posting that argument on the NRA forums?

    • herb02135go - 9 years ago

      If my daughter had an iphone I’d be mad at her, missing or not.

      I didn’t raise a fool to use an iphone.

      • scumbolt2014 - 9 years ago

        Yeah, you’re the only fool in your family you asslicking troll.

      • Madhouse Martin - 9 years ago

        If my daughter had an iPhone and went missing i be glad she has as the only shared App amongst our family is one app I load on every phone under my apple ID that is find my (whatever the unit is) hence I can look and see where she will be if she went missing same for the rest of my family and this is an agreement we all have. If I went missing thats another problem

    • mechanic50 - 9 years ago

      @robertsm76 Have you ever heard of using find my iPhone? If your children are on family sharing, and your wife is you can hit info in any text message window under there name and track exactly where they are if there iPhone is on. Learn how to use the device.

    • You do not understand technology.

    • Mike Knopp (@mknopp) - 9 years ago

      And what do you think this means for the thousands of our wives, husbands, kids, moms, and dads who gave their lives to defend the Constitution and our freedom just for some !%#@!%#$% political tool from the White House, DOJ, or whatever government department to turn around and try to take it away?

      To me that is pissing on their sacrifice and their memory. Forgot some nebulous children from the future who might or might not die. Thousands of someone’s child has already died to defend the American citizens’ right to privacy and protection from illegal search and seizure.

      So, I am thinking about the children. I am thinking about all of the children over the last two hundred plus years who died for freedom that the DOJ wants to take away.

  21. rlowhit - 9 years ago

    This being the case we should abolish search warrants. Because a child killing criminal could be hiding in your residence using an Apple device. Think of the children!

  22. webzpinner - 9 years ago

    Stay strong apple! The moment you sacrifice freedom for safety, you’ve lost both.

  23. Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. – Benjamin Franklin

  24. dday408 - 9 years ago

    Yeah DOJ. Now you play the “child” card… do I smell the “race” card coming next? LOL.

  25. herb02135go - 9 years ago

    Because of this I will go buy a new iPhone.
    Don’t we have too many children on this planet already?

  26. Winski - 9 years ago

    Same old, tired rhetoric we have been delt FOR DECADES by politicins and the dark services that have done little to assist us in growing more and more into a beacon of hope for millions around the planet. To find a single child they say that 300+ MILLION of us must give up another piece of ‘us’.

    POUND SAND.

  27. Klaus Dietrich Lange - 9 years ago

    Good point DoJ! But why not be a little bit more creative ? Some day, you know, a scientist may find a comet heading to Earth. After he stores his findings on his iPhone and before he can warn the world he suddenly dies from a heard attack. As nobody can access the encrypted data we won´t know about the comet, it crashes into our poor little planet and we all die! And it will all be Apples fault!

  28. howardbrittain - 9 years ago

    What a shameful piece of exploitation of children by these “justice” people. This is tantamount to child abuse what they are doing. Exploiting children to achieve their own power obsessed policies.

  29. thats bullshit. increase the public security by distributing the wealth evenly and train the cops properly not spying on people for the excuse of their security absolutely unacceptable.

    • patthecarnut - 9 years ago

      Really!? “distributing the wealth evenly”. How can the Government distribute something they do not possess the rights to? My money is mine if I earned it legally and pay my taxes. Albeit they are essentially redistributing it via ridiculous taxes then handing it to illegals on bogus tax returns and the 51% who don’t want to work like I do. How about get an education and go earn your own! It isn’t my job to earn money for someone who chose not to plan for the future.

  30. scumbolt2014 - 9 years ago

    DoJ= Dept of Jerks

  31. I think they are misusing the word “directly”. I think they mean indirectly.

  32. Mark Granger - 9 years ago

    If strong encryption could lead to the death of a child, what could insecure data lead to?

  33. Don Horne (@DonHorne) - 9 years ago

    The Government used similar tactics on the NYTimes back in Bush’s first term to hold off publishing on the NSA’s spying program. Nothing that comes out of their mouths can, nor should be trusted. And with top lawman Eric Holder immediately taking a $77 million job (plus bonuses) with JPMorgan Chase should serve as a reminder that this is the best government that money can buy. How long before Mitch McConnell and company accuse Apple & Google of being anti-american.

  34. Danny Marchell - 9 years ago

    I wonder how many kids the Government have killed directlyhttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2840726/Labour-candidate-tells-Myleene-Klass-LEAVE-Britain-wiped-floor-Ed-Miliband-mansion-tax.html

  35. Rhynchelma Herion - 9 years ago

    Yes, encryption may well lead to the death of a child.

    How many children are killed in a year by cars that are not restricted to 10mph?

    How many children are killed in schools but gun-wielders, or indeed by guns in general.

    How many children die due to medical mishaps.

    How many children die due to Social Services ineptitude?

    How many children die because if ->insert a whole list of things here<-'?

    Yeah, better not allow phone encryption because it's such a terrible risk.

  36. 89p13 - 9 years ago

    Yes, Ladies & Gentlemen of the US of A – These “Government Officials” are the same people who were hired a direct result of the Senators, Congressmen and Women and the President(s) you have elected over the last 20 to 30 years.

    And as far as the “death of a child” — Bull Shit! It’s like saying that because I insulted my Muslim neighbor, World War III breaks out between His country and the USA.

    What a Vast Load of dung!

  37. Apple hates puppies too.

  38. Darwin Evolved - 9 years ago

    Reminds me of the National Lampoon Magazine issue that had a dog with a gun to it’s head on the cover. The caption: but this magazine or else…

    The Feds are reaching and know they cannot stand on legal ground so they will play the fear card.

  39. patthecarnut - 9 years ago

    As much as a LOATHE criminals and those who prey on children, personal property is personal property. As soon as they get the ability to get into your phone by law, where will they stop? They just need to learn to be better investigators. Freedom is freedom…

  40. patthecarnut - 9 years ago

    Funny though no Brewery, Distillery or Winery is mentioned in the same way, yet they are responsible for killing thousands by DOJ logic. They need to focus on the things that happen most. I’d like to see the statistics on drunk driving deaths compared to scumbags killing kids.

  41. nekomichikun - 9 years ago

    On the flip-side, not encrypting communications from mobile phones could also lead to the death of a child. If a kidnapper intercepts unencrypted information on their victim’s phone, they could potentially have a full picture of the victim’s whereabouts as well as other private information, thus aiding them to plan and commit their crime. The DOJ’s argument means absolutely nothing because it places the blame of crime on the tools of the criminal, rather on the criminals themselves.