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Samsung appeal against Apple’s $930M award for patent infringement begins today

Men are silhouetted against a video screen with Apple and Samsung logos as he poses with Samsung S3 and Samsung S4 smartphones in this photo illustration taken in the central Bosnian town of Zenica

The latest court battle between Apple and Samsung begins today, with Samsung appealing against the $930M it was ordered to pay Apple for patent infringement in the first trial between the two companies. Samsung is arguing that the amount awarded was “excessive and unwarranted.”

It’s of course not the first time that the sum awarded has been disputed. Apple was initially awarded $1B in damages, with $450M of that later cut and a retrial required to determine a revised sum. The retrial awarded Apple $290M instead for that element of the case, giving Apple a revised total award of $930M … 

But Samsung isn’t giving up yet, having filed a brief from 27 law professors, reports Re/codeApple is arguing that Samsung is trying to use the appeal to rehash factual issues already settled during the trial, rather than raising legal arguments which would justify an appeal – and has countered with a series of briefs of its own from design experts and supporters of strong patent protection.

Samsung is separately appealing the verdict of the second patent trial between the two companies where it was ordered to pay Apple $119.6M for infringing five further Apple patents.

Photo credit: Reuters

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Comments

  1. Kasimani Baskaran - 9 years ago

    Samsung believes in stealing Designs and Ideas. The pathetic thing is that Samsung is using Apple’s money as the fuel to fight Apple. At this juncture Samsung is bound to fail in the mobile phone market as the Chinese are trying to follow the same route that Samsung has tried to ground Apple. Apple would still fuel Samsung as Apple relies on Samsung for critical parts. For Samsung the fall is going to be big and it might hurt Apple if it tries to still rely on this copycat supplier…

    • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

      “Samsung believes in stealing Designs and Ideas.” Yes, because only Samsung does that, Apple doesn’t!

      Oh wait…

      http://www.cnet.com/news/time-is-money-apple-pays-21m-for-clock-design-says-report/
      http://www.digitaltrends.com/apple/judge-rules-against-apple-in-facetime-lawsuit/

      That’s just 2 examples, but hey, don’t let the Samsung bashing get in the way of facts!

      • Mike Knopp (@mknopp) - 9 years ago

        How about you don’t let the whole iOS vs Android !^%^# get in the way of the facts.

        The facts are that Samsung does believe in stealing designs and ideas and they have been doing it for far longer than iOS or the iPhone ever existed. This whole mess is just one more step in Samsung’s pretty much standard policy of copying from competitors and then running them out of business by using their vertical manufacturing capabilities and lack of expenditure on R&D to undercut the original designer in price.

        They did this in the television market. They did this in the home appliance market. And now they are trying to do this in the mobile market.

        Samsung’s misbehavior is a very well documented fact and is much, MUCH, bigger and more encompassing than anything to do with something as childish as an iOS/Android name calling match.

        Just look into the corruption and bribery scandals that have plagued the company over the years.

        They are a corrupt company. Period. And this is a fact that has nothing to do with Apple.

        Interestingly, they are losing this time because Apple has a vertical layer that Samsung can’t match, a mobile OS, and Chinese companies aren’t constrained by their government like the Japanese, Taiwanese, and American companies were. The Chinese manufacturers are eating Samsung alive from the bottom because they are so much bigger and are operating in practically the same way that Samsung has for decades, copy and produce cheaper. So, for the first time Samsung’s standard business practice of copy and undercut in price while avoiding lawsuits or tying everything up in court until the verdict doesn’t matter isn’t working. They are finally getting what they deserve.

        And anyone who doesn’t want to admit this simply because of some moronic iOS vs Android zealotry isn’t worth taking seriously.

      • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

        Totally, because there aren’t a million TV companies out there. Or a million different Appliance companies. It is funny that facts that Apple isn’t a saint makes people you rabid and foam at the mouth to defend a company, who in all reality, doesn’t give a shit about you.

      • Brand (@brandjohnson) - 9 years ago

        Are you REALLY trying to state the examples above are ANYTHING CLOSE to what Samsung is doing? I’d hope that you are a bit more intelligent then that!

    • herb02135go - 9 years ago

      How are you enjoying the features that are new to iPhone but have been on Samsung phones for about a year?

      Yea, Apple rips off Samsung alright and the sheep still get their parents to buy the shiny products.
      Such group – think is bad for civilization.

      • Mike Knopp (@mknopp) - 9 years ago

        And the whole iOS vs Android childishness is moot to the point.

        Samsung has for decades and in multiple markets followed a policy of copy and undercut.

        This is about far more than design convergence, and if you can’t see that then you need to grow up.

      • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

        Getting rabid and foaming at the mouth when someone talks about Apple and going on a rampage is childish. Perhaps you need to grow up.

      • Mike Knopp (@mknopp) - 9 years ago

        You still don’t get it. I am not defending Apple. My beef with Samsung has nothing to do with Apple.

        Samsung is a corrupt company that has been destroying other companies by stealing their ideas for decades. They have ruined people’s lives.

        It is the fact that you would support a company like Samsung because they are competitors with Apple is what is childish.

        Eliminate Apple from this headline and can you honestly tell me that you would support this company?

        This isn’t about Apple it is about Samsung. When you can see that then I will stop calling you childish, but until then this whole naive “I love Samsung because they aren’t Apple” thing is pretty much the definition of immature and ignorant, which is a defining characteristic of children.

      • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

        Your first and last mistake is assuming I support Samsung and on that note, I have nothing further to say to you. Samsung doesn’t dictate your life or mine. Get over it. Grow up and move the fuck on.

        Quit being a butt-hurt Apple bitch, it’s really sad and pathetic.

      • Mike Knopp (@mknopp) - 9 years ago

        Like I said, childish.

        Nothing that I have said has been in any way, shape or form in support of Apple.

        Yet, I disagree with you, which automatically makes me a “butt-hurt Apple bitch”. That certainly proves false my claim of childish.

        Then again, what can I say about myself. Like my old coach used to say, “Never wrestle with a pig. You’ll both get muddy, but the pig will love it.”

        I do agree with you on one thing. I am done with you. I do have better things to do.

      • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

        Thanks for your opinion about “being childish”, we really don’t care. YOU are acting like a child, a child who isn’t getting what he wants. Anyone here can SEE this.

  2. ryan9to5 - 9 years ago

    The funny thing is, apple still relies on Samsung for quality parts and efficient manufacturing. Samsung should still deny wrong but accept faith or just bill ’em the next time they tap the shoulders to help build the next Iphone.Patenting the method of building a rectangle is understandable, patenting a rectangle is ridiculous!

    • Mike Knopp (@mknopp) - 9 years ago

      I am so sick and tired of hearing that Apple sued Samsung because of a rounded rectangle shape. That was one of the aspects that Apple sued Samsung over. There were literally pages and pages of “simple” things that Samsung copied. Each one taken individually sound just as ridiculous as “Apple patented a rectangle”, but taken together it was a pretty egregious example of copying.

      Let me put it this way. This would be like Ford copying the design of a Honda Civic right down to the format and style of the owner’s manual. Then if Honda sued Ford people would claim it as being ridiculous because Honda is trying to patent a bolt. The bolt is only a single part of the overall design that was copied.

      People just really don’t seem to understand design patents. It isn’t about one single element of design, which are almost always simple concepts, it is about all of the simple concepts put together.

      So, please, can we stop perpetuating the Samsung PR machine’s line about Apple suing them over the rounded rectangular shape? If that had been all that Samsung had copied from Apple there never would have been a lawsuit, but it wasn’t.

      • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

        Jesus Christ dude, quit being such a butt-hurt fan-boy.

        “There were literally pages and pages of “simple” things that Samsung copied. ” EVERY company does this.

      • Mike Knopp (@mknopp) - 9 years ago

        Yes, every company copies ideas. That is why ideas are not patentable.

        I am not an Apple fanboy, and the fact that you can’t seem to understand that makes me think that this is pointless. Apple has done some underhanded things. They have copied ideas. They have even done things that are illegal or immoral. They often do stupid things that piss me off. They aren’t perfect and never will be.

        That doesn’t mean that I cannot rationally look at a case brought by Apple and say, “Yeah, Samsung violated their design patent.”

        You are the one that is acting like an anti-Apple zealot. You don’t seem capable of rationally looking at anything dealing with Apple. You seem to be adopting a firm stance of everything Apple does is bad and everything that anyone does against Apple is good or justifiable.

        If you can’t handle the facts, then perhaps you are the one “being a butt-hurt fan-boy”. It is a fact that there literally were pages and pages of things that Apple alleged Samsung copied from them. It is a matter of public record. Look it up.

      • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

        “Apple alleged Samsung” Nothing more to say. Apple alleges a lot of shit, the most idiotic one is that Google stole Android. And stop with the “I’m not an Apple fanboy”, you are so transparent everyone can see through you. It’s so painfully obvious you are upset over them “copying apple” that you are acting like a fucking raging lunatic.

        No company is perfect and free of underhanded shit, including Apple.

        Yep, Samsung has done what you said, big deal, they don’t run my life but they sure are running yours. LOL

      • herb02135go - 9 years ago

        Mike- no one gives a shit about what facts you are tired of hearing.

        Brown-noser.

    • Rich Davis (@RichDavis9) - 9 years ago

      Here’s why Android should have been shut down from Day 1.

      First off, the first Andriod phones had keyboards Al La Blackberry. But when Apple first started their iPhone development, Google’s Eric Schmidt was on Apple’s Board of Directors getting compensated to work on Apple’s board. And being on the Board, he has to sign a NDA, which means he’s not allowed to say ANYTHING TO ANYONE ABOUT ANYTHING HE SEES OR KNOWS ABOUT ANYTHING THAT APPLE IS WORKING ON.

      So, the second he had Google change gears to begin development of the OS to make it a full screen OS like Apple’s is the second he violated his NDA with Apple. He also knew Apple was working with Samsung, who has copied Blackberry, Palm with their look a likes. The other thing was that Samsung has a very large document examining Apple’s iPhones, and even Eric Schmidt told Samsung not to be so obvious about coping Apple’s design.

      Taking information from a company that’s not public information is a form of corporate theft, which is a felony as far as I’m aware.

      Eric Schmidt is lucky Apple didn’t sue the crap out of him and have him prosecuted for corporate theft and just gotten an injunction to have Android taken off the market the first day they released their product.

      I’m sorry for any Fandroids that don’t like this lawsuit, but Samsung is getting off light in this case.

      If there is any part of Android that’s Open Source, then it’s OPEN for anyone to use/copy it, since it’s Open Source. But Apple’s OS is not open source, many aspects of it have patents.

      • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

        “First off, the first Andriod phones had keyboards Al La Blackberry. But when Apple first started their iPhone development, Google’s Eric Schmidt was on Apple’s Board of Directors getting compensated to work on Apple’s board. And being on the Board, he has to sign a NDA, which means he’s not allowed to say ANYTHING TO ANYONE ABOUT ANYTHING HE SEES OR KNOWS ABOUT ANYTHING THAT APPLE IS WORKING ON.”

        This tired argument? Really?

        “So, the second he had Google change gears to begin development of the OS to make it a full screen OS like Apple’s is the second he violated his NDA with Apple. He also knew Apple was working with Samsung, who has copied Blackberry, Palm with their look a likes. The other thing was that Samsung has a very large document examining Apple’s iPhones, and even Eric Schmidt told Samsung not to be so obvious about coping Apple’s design.”

        Google has already stated it supported touchscreen from the beginning. So another tired argument.

        They didn’t sue, because, they had nothing to sue on.

        I am sorry for you Macolytes that think you have an inkling of what actually happened between these 2 companies.

    • Rich Davis (@RichDavis9) - 9 years ago

      I wonder what would have happened if Eric Scmidt wasn’t on Apple’s Board and Apple was using Intel to make the processors and Apple went to other suppliers for the other major components.

      • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

        They would have still made the phone, and Intel wasn’t making mobile processors at that time AFAIK.

  3. Mike Knopp (@mknopp) - 9 years ago

    For those of you supporting Samsung because “Apple steals ideas too”. You really should read the article that the Verge did on Lee Kun-hee a couple of years ago.

    http://www.theverge.com/2012/11/30/3709688/samsung-25-years-lee-kun-hee

    This is the company that you are supporting, for seemingly no reason other than they aren’t Apple.

    • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

      The Verge is a bunch of biased losers… quite ironic you would mention them.

      • flaviosuave - 9 years ago

        “a bunch of biased losers” says the Samsung troll with “69” in his user name even though he’s never seen the ass end of a woman since he popped out of his mom (who never loved him to begin with).

      • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

        Oh gee, you got me! Yes, my 2 daughters just happened to be born by immaculate conception. You are a fucking retard. And Samsung troll? I use LG. So, wrong again. But hey, keep trying! Moron.

    • herb02135go - 9 years ago

      I buy Samsung products when they provide the best value to me.

      I used to buy Apple products but they are are overpriced, have outdated technology and features.
      If it wasn’t for mindless sheep and people who like PlaySchool-like devices, Apple would fold.

      • Air Burt - 9 years ago

        You’ve got it backwards my ignorant friend. Apple will continue to thrive even as mindless bafoons like you continue to blindly buy phones that consistently perform worse than Apple’s current flagship and get less OS updates. Us intelligent consumers will continue buying iPhones that out-perform your Android crap and allow us to upgrade to the latest OS all on the same day. 90+% of iPhones can/are update/updated to iOS 8 RIGHT NOW, while the vast majority of Android phones probably won’t see Lollipop for at least a few more MONTHS. Enjoy your “Playskool-like device” that you’ll probably just drop in the toilet anyway! I’m sure those Samsung checks will just buy you a new piece of junk.

      • Albert Davis - 9 years ago

        How’s your Apple check Ari?

      • Air Burt - 9 years ago

        That you, herb? It’s sad that you have to make more accounts to defend yourself. The responses are even more pathetic when you think you’re fooling others.

  4. Arnold Ziffel - 9 years ago

    The DoJ has made it clear they are OK with Apple’s competitors stealing Apple’s IP.

  5. Rich Davis (@RichDavis9) - 9 years ago

    This aught to be funny. They’ll probably use the, But, but, but we are losing tons of money in unsold S5’s.

    Just pay the deal, you’re getting off light. Apple should now add their iBeacon and Continuity rip-off’s to the list and increase the amount to $2.5 billion and then completely shut down Samsung’s Android products for-freakin-ever.

    • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

      You do realize ibeacon is just Bluetooth?

      • No, Bluetooth is the underlying communication layer. iBeacon is a location-aware notification platform, utilizing the Bluetooth standard, that alerts users within a certain distance of said suppliers beacon of deals/sales/whatever is deemed relevant by the supplier. Bluetooth alone does nothing. This is a software and hardware platform, designed and built by Apple, Inc.

  6. nekomichikun - 9 years ago

    I’m getting tired of seeing companies squabbling amongst each other already. Isn’t there a limit to how many times a case can be appealed and re-trialled? There seems to be no end in this…

  7. Charles Alden - 9 years ago

    This lawsuit had nothing to do with intellectual property or design patents, just good old fashion greed and the pursuit of power, that’s it. Samsung is the closest competitor to Apple, thus they needed to be brought down. If you look at other companies products, specifically Xiaomi with phones like the M4 or the new Nokia N1, which is a carbon copy of the iPad Mini, they make Samsung look like saints. Their not worth the trouble though because they don’t pose a threat. Mark my words though, once the Nokia N1 starts selling like 5 – 10 million units, Apple will have them in court so fast it will make your head spin. Apple is very anti-competitive, one just needs to try and change the default browser in iOS to see that, which by the way Microsoft got in trouble for something similar, but at least with them you could at least change the friggen defaults to something other than an Apple app.

    I’m no Samsung lover either, in fact I find their products to be tasteless and cheap looking, not to mention they have one of the worst Android iterations I have ever seen. These are corporations, in it for the money, they don’t care about you and would rather see you in the ground than acknowledge your existence but for some reason companies like Apple, Samsung, etc. have this loyal consumer group behind them that get insulted when something negative is said about them. To these people I say, you have a problem, weren’t held as a child often enough, bullied in school, who knows but please don’t trust the bastards. Personally, I now use a Razor laptop and tablet with Linux, and a Jolla phone. Any company with as much power and money as Apple and Samsung need to be avoided at all costs.

    • sircheese69 - 9 years ago

      Touchwiz isn’t an iteration.

      “TouchWiz is a front-end touch interface developed by Samsung Electronics with partners, featuring a full touch user interface. It is sometimes incorrectly identified as an operating system.”

  8. Air Burt - 9 years ago

    Ben, please ban herb02135go from this site. All he does is troll, shill for Samsung and doesn’t actually contribute any accurate information to any article. Trolls like him are a menace to the internet and need to be stopped by those like you who have the power to do so. This isn’t a matter of free speech; it’s about human decency and the fact that he has none.

    • Ben Lovejoy - 9 years ago

      WordPress does not, in its infinite wisdom, allow commentators to be banned. Please don’t paste in the same text in multiple places – thanks.

      • Air Burt - 9 years ago

        Accounts can be banned for abuse, which is what he is doing.

      • Albert Davis - 9 years ago

        He said, accounts can’t be banned. And you are sitting here trying to tell him they can, I think he would know slightly better than you. Typical Apple user, think they know everything when in reality, they don’t.

      • Air Burt - 9 years ago

        I know how WordPress works. Accounts can be shut down for violating the ToS, which includes abuse. All you seem to be doing on here is trying to correct others, when really you know nothing. Go home, no one here needs your useless “contributions”.

      • Albert Davis - 9 years ago

        Yes, your “contribution” is clearly much better, trying to get people banned because you don’t like what they have to say. Take your own advice, go home. I really don’t think anyone is impressed with your “contribution”. You were even asked to stop spamming shit in multiple threads, seems the problem lies with you.

      • Air Burt - 9 years ago

        Yep, I have actually opinions based on facts that correlate with the article, things that neither you or herb have. I suggest you go before you become as well known a troll as herb is.

      • Albert Davis - 9 years ago

        Everyone has opinions based on the article, that you think yours is more valid or more worthy than others says it all. And you honestly think I give a shit if people like you think I am a troll? No, I don’t. Considering you, based on your few posts I have seen, are well above most on this site in the troll dept. It’s people like you that drag these types of forums down. You have already been told by someone who works for 9to5 to pipe down, again, the problem is YOU, not anyone else.

        And on that note, I am done feeding….

      • Air Burt - 9 years ago

        Oh so you’re new here! A troll from the beginning, I see. It’s not too late for you to turn back.

        My contributions here have always been useful. Again, you have no clue what you’re talking about. Shrink back into your cave.

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Avatar for Ben Lovejoy Ben Lovejoy

Ben Lovejoy is a British technology writer and EU Editor for 9to5Mac. He’s known for his op-eds and diary pieces, exploring his experience of Apple products over time, for a more rounded review. He also writes fiction, with two technothriller novels, a couple of SF shorts and a rom-com!


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